generally frustrated :(

[erzengelb]

Well, it's been getting harder and harder to find non-legit servers to play on. The Gates of Norrath is seemingly gone now, was the last server I enjoyed at all. I just can't stomach playing on legit or semi-legit servers; Please don't get me wrong, I appreciate and respect the countless hours of toil that has gone into these servers. However, any way you slice it, it's still broken play. Severall AAs, spells, skills and quests still don't work as intended. And while I understand that it's a monolithic undertaking, I just don't feel like fooling with it. To me, there is no point in levelling up a broken class in a broken version of the game.

EQEmu has always been for me a place where I could do and see things I would never get to experience in the live version. I.E., non-legit play. Seeing just how much HP i could get on a warrior with gear and spells, for example. Trying to solo very difficult encounters solo or duo. To me, EQEmu has always been about sandbox play. Never about trying to emulate live. Because it never will. Even now, in it's most stable and playable form thus far, it's still at least a year behind live.

And I fully understand the limitations of trying to stay compatible with Live, it's impossible. I guess I'm just frustrated because there are no more non-legit servers to play on. To me, that was the point, rather than forcing myself to level up with several handicaps. I imagine it was the abusers and a$$hats that did away with non-legit play...lord knows I was vocal a few years ago trying to preserve it. But to no avail it seems.

I know what many of you are thinking; "If you want a non-legit server, why don't you just make your own???". Excellent question. And please believe me when I say I tried. I tried very hard. You see, I'm not a network administrator. I didn't get an associate's degree at ITT or Devry. My computing knowledge is quite limited. All I know to do is follow the very few tutorials that are available, and honestly, with software updating so quickly (newer versions), it's little wonder someone like me would get frustrated trying to setup a server, only to get errors at even the earliest stages of the setup. No, I tried, and would absolutely love to have my own server, but I'm simply not smart enough. Which is exactly what I was told by several folks, including developers and moderators, in irc chat when I tried to get assistance. While I certainly didn't appreciate being called moron/idiot/clownshoes??, I also understand that experts in a field can't stand what they consider elementary and needless questions. Then again, how many ITT/Devry graduates are really an expert at anything? Sorry, bad taste...

No, I learned long ago to keep my mouth shut if I didn't understand something, so creating a server is out for me.

So I guess the whole point of this, besides to vent (and it's not really a vent, it's just a video game, and free at that, so not a big deal I guess) is to swallow some pride and BEG someone to create a non-legit server for us non-legitties to play on.

I mean, in all honesty, and in all fairness to the community, I would rather pay 15 bucks a month for smooth legit play than struggle for free...:/

Having said that, I still fully support EQEmu and am thankful for its existence.

[kedra]

Send me an email at dwmaze at gmail dot com. I will help you up a server if you want.

When i came to EQEmu I didn't even know how to create a zip file..

The directions are there you just need to follow them step by step.


The directions are so clear I have had my children create a server with no help from me, just following the directions.


People who say they cant either haven't tried or didn't follow the directions.

Now there are some weird issues that pop up, and the support on the forums for them is there, and good.

[CrabClaw]

When I came her I knew nothing either and had to figure it all out by myself and scarfing the wiki's and reading old posts for ideas. If you can get a minilogin server running you can tweak it from there, I do all the time (item and money drop rates, various server variables and even making my own quests, and tradeskill recipes). But don't be afraid to ask for help.

But one thing with the Emu scene is that it is always changing sometimes things are awsome and then things turn to something that you might not like. I usually take it in stride and roll with it.

What type of server/rule set are you looking for though? EQEmu will always be kinda 50/50 a playing game and a tweakers/hobbyist pastime. I love to get into the database and mess with things, learn a little more Perl and SQL, and try to contribute something cool when I can, but I do love to kick back with a friend and farm CoM or Dulak for cool stuff too.

I do realize though EQ is a UBER-HUGE game and they will never get every zone, expansion, spell, quest, monster spawn, class AA, and instance to work 100% or even by the book. Although, this is something that every MMO-emu shares and they all are in a persistent state of ratcheting progress. I do think the progress this EMU has made over the last year has been amazing, and as long as people contribute to the hobby it will only get better.

[erzengelb]

This is the guide I attempted to use for setup;

http://techguynky.com/Documents/Guide.pdf

It seemed more user friendly and less condescending than the wiki, which for some reason i'm unable to locate the setup guide there at this time. I am aware that the above guide has some typos, but at least I could follow along. I imagine my problem comes from the timeliness of that particular guide. I remember particularly that I couldn't locate the same version of MySQL he was using, and one of my first big hiccups involved trying to import the peq db into MySQL.

Regardless, it didn't work after trying for three days and being made to feel like an idiot in irc may float some boats, but not mine.

As for locating and reading the info available, please keep in mind that a novice like me can't differentiate what works and what USED to work. While there are tons of helpful folks involved with this project, and I hate to say this, there are a larger number who just want to feel superior and lord it over the rest of us. I imagine their day jobs are customer service and tech support in real life. Nothing I can do to change that.

What's the big turnoff with non-legit play anyway? How can twinking yourself out and taking Kerafyrm solo possibly be any more boring than levelling up 70 levels without working quests, a player econmy or a complete implement of abilities?

I don't mean to sound so whiney. I'll get with that guy and try to get a server working I suppose. Wish me luck I guess.

[Zengez]

I think the big reason people like to play the 70 levels is because it gives more a feeling of legitimate accomplishment, and the dynamic when you do something fun with some friends that you can then talk about the next day about how you 'just barely pulled through that terrible train you called a pull!' etc etc... That being said I think you touched on a good point which is that everyone always says to go read the wikki, which I think is a good idea that most people don't both trying... which leads to the frustration on the end of those that try to help, because they end up answering the same questions a billion times (Wait... you're saying I should get titanium and not patch to live? What difference does it make? why can't you do it BETTER?... etc...) and yes.... even the nicest people get pretty short tempered in that situation.

All that being said though, the wikki seems to be outdated on some very important areas, like how to set up a server (last I checked which has been a little while I'll admit) and although all the information is availible, it is only availible to those that know where to find it... you need to sift through sections to find helpful tid bits and put them together yourself most of the time... Really the best part of the wikki is the use by the coders and the database workers, because they really know how to take useful bits and leave the outdated parts... But to a guy that doesn't have any idea what is good or what is outdated, it can be a maze...

Point of the story? Stop complaining about it and fix it... thats what makes a wiki great, you can update it. I would do so myself if I had time, which is unfortunately the excuse most people use, but in a project like this it's the unavoidable byproduct... We're a ragtag group of people doing work in our free time... which isn't terribly often nowadays at least for me

and... thats that. /rant off.

Just a side note here,


The only servers that last (get donations, dedicated players etc) are the custom servers that dont try to emulate live. No offense to PeQ there the exception not the rule.

Non legit server die so quick because people dont keep playing them because there boring after 10 min. If there isnt people to donate to keep the server running it cant keep running.


Most people here dont want a **like live** experience, they want the live type game play but with new things, brings back the original OMG this is cool feeling again.

[Angelox]

Originally Posted by erzengelb

there are a larger number who just want to feel superior and lord it over the rest of us. I imagine their day jobs are customer service and tech support in real life. Nothing I can do to change that.

You know, I thought this too at one time, but I can tell you, you're wrong (and so was I). These people you look for are just not around; they leave everything running (Mirc server or client and what-not), but they are not there. The times I have caught them on, they have been very nice and cooperative to me.
But like I said, I used to *think* this, not go around ranting it, because if I would have, then I really would have them pissed at me and would never have gotten any help.
You don't need any help of any kind on running your own server - I didn't, and if I didn't , then no one else does. I learned everything I know right here in these forums. Not even the Wiki! Just the forums. When I needed to learn perl, I looked on the web, and MySql the same.
I'm "living proof" anyone can run a server and customize it anyway they want - all you need is the will and patience to do it.
Hell, I can hardly even type! no one ever taught me, so I have to look at the keyboard and find the letters with my two fingers.

[techguy84]

Personally, I thought that after so many years on LIVE, I could not tolerate the same thing, so I wanted non-legit servers. After playing on them, I realized that is not what I want either. Then it hit me, I want a LIVE expiernce, but a accellerated one. Dont hand me End Game Stuff, let me earn it, but in a fraction of the time. Here in lies the issue that I had with the emulator. You can raise the xp rate and level faster, but your skills didnt take the same course. Next thing you know, your level 30 and your skills are 30, which sucks cause you cant cast or hit anything.

Ok, now for the topic de-rail, but I appoligize,

@erzengelb

I think you didnt look hard enough to find MySQL. I can go and download just about any older version right now at this very instance. Same goes with Perl also. You can not use MySQL 6 at the moment due to some sourcing issue in multiple tables, so you have to get a version circa 5.0.24-5.0.37 (only version I have confirmed, maybe more). Once you find that you should be a bit better off. I didnt direct link to files incase they change locations, I just showed you a general area to go. PM me if you have any questions about this and I will be more than glad to help you out.

[leslamarch]

I just need to add something, out of all the replies gotten on this topic Everyone was helpful and Sympathetic. That is just amazing, with a post like this on any other emu site there would have been 200 flames. This is just a great community of people here.
Thanks so much for all the help
LL

[sfisque]

i have to agree. on a whim, i tried building a WoW emu server, and after trying two different avenues and coming up empty, i realized eqemu is light years ahead of other emu projects.

and its not because we have better tech, better dev, or better code.

its because we have a better community. when something breaks, someone steps up and tries to fix it. i didnt get that impression with them. i walked away with the feeling that if you werent inside the "cool kids clique" you were out of luck. i dont get that here.

anyone who steps in here and flames about support can "suck it". the wealth of info in the wiki, in the forums, in the irc, and in the source is immense. if you cant find help/info here, you didnt look. period.

/applaud everyone in the eqemu community

== sfisque

[John Adams]

Originally Posted by sfisque

i have to agree. on a whim, i tried building a WoW emu server, and after trying two different avenues and coming up empty, i realized eqemu is light years ahead of other emu projects.

Actually, I have to disagree here. No offense to those still maintaining EQEmu, but the WoW Emulators (http://www.emupedia.com - Antrix, specifically) have so much effort behind it, and it supports current client so people are not having to maintain multiple copies of their clients just to try different emulators. I feel the WoWEmu dev community is far more advanced than EQEmu merely by numbers involved. There are 100's of developers world-wide that tweak, mod, enhance, both the core and database. We have what, 4 people here that do it, and only when they have a chance? Again, no offense meant. It's the reality that this game (EQ) is fairly out dated, and only die hards like us are interested in it anymore. WoW is a phenomenon like no other... you have to admit that. And I don't even like the game, personally.

Example, I have never played a single minute of WoW. But, I took the Antrix source, load the project into VS2005, hit compile, loaded my DB, and played. Within 2 hours. Now, I host a private server (added to my collection muhaha) and love it. Btw, if you think the EQEmu community has some retarded members... try wading through the WoWEmu support forums. Holy Gods, that's painful.



Editorial Time:
What the EQEmu community is lacking is "interest". Sure there's dozens of newbies that come along monthly that want to setup a server. They beg for help, but most point them to the Wiki, which is a disaster in itself. Thank god for the newer document projects like Techguy's and a few others.

EQEmu needs current client compatibility. Why doesn't it? Because the only brave souls willing to keep maintaining the code do not have the time (or interest) in "chasing live". This is an effect of there being so few devs involved. If we had 100 devs world-wide, chasing live would be effortless. So do not blame our dev team for halting compatibility at Titanium.

EQEmu *does* need a repack, but the old schoolers are so arrogant they think Joe-Admin should learn how to disect IP packets just to earn the privilege to run their precious emulator. This thing is so out-dated and incomplete, it's laughable to make people waste so much time learning when they can try, and quit, all within a few days instead of months of begging for help. Again, thanks for Cavedude's original server pack for attempting to make things easier - but it could be taken one step further by making it a completely pre-configured, brainless, effortless package that you unzip, run, and login.

Anyway, the point here is that I feel this game (in general) is dying, because compared to some modern games, it's pretty ugly. I love Everquest, and I will probably play the live game until they shut down the last server. But with WoW, EQ2, Vanguard, and a few other emulators cropping up, this project either needs a jump-start, or it's just not going to be worth anyones time anymore.

[sfisque]

Originally Posted by John Adams

Example, I have never played a single minute of WoW. But, I took the Antrix source, load the project into VS2005, hit compile, loaded my DB, and played. Within 2 hours. Now, I host a private server (added to my collection muhaha) and love it. Btw, if you think the EQEmu community has some retarded members... try wading through the WoWEmu support forums. Holy Gods, that's painful.

and... for those of us who use linux to host, the current build didnt compile. they even said so in the forum and that there was no targetted date for it to be fixed (that may have changed since then, but i was unimpressed). windoze isnt a viable hosting platform. anyone who thinks so, hasnt been hacked yet. yet. and the setup documentation was weak at best if you weren't targetting windows. at least to eqemu's credit, the linux support is quite well done. the product compiles out of the box without any strange dependencies, etc.

/shrug.

== sfisque

[cavedude]

Originally Posted by John Adams

Again, thanks for Cavedude's original server pack for attempting to make things easier - but it could be taken one step further by making it a completely pre-configured, brainless, effortless package that you unzip, run, and login.

That's a great idea, I was planning on releasing a more up to date version of the installer. Perhaps I'll have two versions, one configurable, one not. That'll help new users get up and running quickly again.

As for how advanced EQEmu is in terms of compared to other emulators... My 2 cents is that while I agree Mangos/Antrix (both WoW) are both a bit more advanced than EQEmu, I have to say we are a solid 2nd. Antrix is in reality a fork of Mangos, they didn't start from scratch. Dawn of Light (Dark Age of Camelot) and L2J (Lineage II) are also excellent projects, but they seriously lack the network support the 3 projects above it have. The rest of the projects I have found simply lack the features to even compare. They are all partially playable at best.

The problem surrounding most of the projects is lack of interest. I personally blame WoW. Since it came along, it has drawn a lot of interest away from other online games, both live and emulated. EQ and EQEmu have it doubly bad because we have EQ2 to contend with as well. The one thing about EQEmu that I can say is that it has a never die attitude. Most other projects would have gone defunct by this point, but even at the worst times EQEmu continues on.

If EQEmu had the support that WoW and Pre-CU SWG emus have, we'd have a polished fully compatible live server by now, with a fully popped db to go with it. But, we have to just make do with what we do have and remember, considering a good portion of projects fail before they even get off the ground we have got it pretty good.

[techguy84]

John, I would quote your whole post, but thats a lot of words.

I have to agree with you 100%. What this project is lacking is dev's, but dev's are not going to flock to this because of the game itself. EQ is old, and by old I mean what, 8 years now this game has been out. That itself is where the problem lies. Nobody really wants to get into it as much as they used to because of its outdated looks, outdated combat system, outdated everything. Hell, if the dev's got on here tommorw and said the project is done, and they agree to drop it, I would not be supprised because of how old the product their emulating is.

I have to admit. When I looked at WoW, I cringed at its cartoon graphics, but the game has alot going for it. The combat system is like EQ2, meaing that you cant just push attack and walk away. The items are plentiful, and the amount of area in terms of explorability is enourmous. I picked it up, and played it, and I am impressed. By no means what I was origanlly with EQ, but lets face it, nothing will come close to what EQ did for everyone out there.

Antrix is awesome. It is very well built and very stable. I looked at one of the major private servers and they had upwards of 2000 people on it with minimal lag. Takes alot to get those numbers. Having to compile it sucked, and in terms of support, your better off asking your kids how to do it as emupedia is just nuts. I got it working though, with little knowledge I had of clicking buttons, sourced in my DB just like I would here, edit the config, and poof ready made server. One feature I like about Antrix is how it does the skill leveling. You can set your XP rate to like 20x and the skills will rise at the same pace so they dont get left behind.

I still love EqEmu, and EQ, but what holds me back is not the status of this emulator, but the game itself. I hate looking at those graphics when I just got done playing Oblivion.

Added Note: As far as how we have to chase live, and the WoW emu's dont, its mostly due to the fact that Blizzard distibutes thier changes in lump sums and they are downloadable from many websites. SOE doesnt do this. If you need a certain version of WoW, simply patch to that version and stop. Why can't sony do this for us, would be really nice of them lol.....